> Not sure if that is better than just using a helicopter however.
Anyone who has done first responder training should have had it drilled into their skulls to remember the number one rule .... "do not add yourself to the injury list".
If you're operating in a war-zone its kind of the same thing. Send in a helicopter to drop off one or more guys and you are also sending in bare minimum of one extra person but realistically almost certainly three extra people (two at the front and one at the back to watch the people jumping out).
Also drones are probably somewhat cheaper than helicopters. Both to buy and to operate.
Please don't post political/ideological rhetoric on HN. It doesn't matter how correct your position is or how correct you feel it is; it only leads to back and forth arguments between people on opposing sides, and that's just what we're trying to avoid. Please aim for curious conversation at all times here. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
That’s an issue that can be debated at the appropriate time and place, but it’s not the topic of this article, so it’s a generic tangent and flamebait, which the guidelines specifically ask us to avoid.
I wish “even Republicans” but that party stands for nothing any more, it isn’t even conservative. It’s the most bizarre and morally bankrupt thing I’ve seen in American politics and I’ve been paying attention since the 80s.
> even Republicans are beginning to wonder what dirt Putin has on Trump.
What dirt could they possibly have on him that would actually matter to the voters that voted for him last time?
Not trolling or rhetorical; that's a completely sincere question. Even if something "bad" were to surface, his supporters would simply deny it and/or ignore it, same as they've done for all the other things he's done that are already known.
You can pretty much divide American voters into two camps right now: the ones who loathe him and the ones who DGAF (non-voting voters being in the latter category).
> What dirt could they possibly have on him that would actually matter to the voters that voted for him last time?
Some segment will always deny any dirt that comes out but I think most would become fairly adverse to him if, say, conclusive evidence of child sexual abuse surfaced.
Today in Kharkiv, a Russian drone killed a baby in a stroller and two women, injuring 7 others. [0]
Meanwhile, Musk and Trump are pointing figures at each about who set the speed limit on Starlink/shield terminals, which apparently affects interceptors. The USA also stopped giving Ukraine ballistic missile warnings.
Was it two years ago, or even longer, that Akhmat troops claimed Ukrainian drones tried to abduct their men in the field? Who knows, it might end up actually happen one day. Wild.
Pretty horrifying prospect really. Imagine the buzzing of a huge drone descending upon you from nowhere, before it just grabs you with its metal arms, and whisks you away into the sky, lol.
Guess it's better than dropping nades on top of you, maybe :/
If a drone wanted to kill you, it would use a bullet. Cheapest and easiest way, with the least risk to the drone.
The extraction case would only be for high-value targets (enemy military/economic/political leaders), where having them alive would give leverage on having them order their organizations to do something useful for the drone owner.
for the Russian soldiers, it would certainly be a better fate than remaining on the field for a few more tens of minutes before they die (on average). AFAICT, they are treated better in Ukrainian POW camps than in the Russian deployed positions
Right, highlight the one incident on the Ukrainian side vs the standard war-crimes treatment by the Russians, and yes, there are also a number of incidents during capture on the both sides.
Also note the mismatch in POWs died in captivity returned by Ukraine (14) vs by Russia (>1000, as of [0]).
And note the overall condition of Russian soldiers returned is well-fed, and Ukrainians returned are barely walking.
It has been some 400 years since Cardinal Richelieu said "If you give me six lines written by the hand of the most honest of men, I will find something in them which will hang him." [1] We can always find an exception to condemn someone.
Our task is instead to try to get a fair grasp on what is happening. Highlighting the exceptional event out of context is not helpful
From outside it seems that Ukraine is not really given a choice right now but to defend itself. I wish for a soon end to the war so your beautiful country can prosper again and your people can start healing.
A woman wrote "I ask for bread" in the snow in front of her house. A passing drone photographed it. This led to a later mission to air drop food to her.
It is a good innovation in the same way a shield is a good innovation. Perhaps people do not always want to innovate in the area of war, but instead doing something else, but they are forced to innovate like this.
Supporting Ukraine’s defense against invasion has had better ROI than most domestic defense spending. For a pittance we’ve let a major adversary weaken itself considerably. We should do more.
I think the European countries' leadership are well aware that if Russia is not decisively defeated in Ukraine now, returning every square meter of UA territory back to Ukrainian control, they'll be fighting the Russian army in actual NATO locations even further west in 2, 5 or 7 years from now.
Europe are already fighting Russia. Russia has made scores of "hybrid war" attacks throughout Europe and GB, including attempted bomb-laden drones at Leipzeig airport, cutting numerous undersea cables, and even "errant" drone attacks. They are also likely behind amplifying the current unrest in France.
EU politicians don't want to acknowledge the ongoing war because they think it would be an escalation and they also have a fear of 'Russia breaking up'. Other than the Baltic states, they don't realize the only way to stop it is push back, hard and fast, as Ukraine is doing. The Russian military is low-capability and declining, reliant now on North Korea and Iran, and the economy is sliding. The reality is little could be better than Russia breaking up and finally abandoning it's imperial ambitions, which are still active today.
They probably will, but they won't get the votes to override a presidential veto (2/3 of both chambers). The very best case scenario is that Trump is impeached and Vance doesn't have any serious kompromat.
It's possible that enough Republicans will be looking for a clean break with Trump and may be willing to get Vance in his place, especially with Trump's recent dealings with Russia and Ukraine. The MAGA voting base is looking less devoted with the recent economic developments as well and might not be so keen on his candidates in 2029. Also, if dems get the majority we may be seeing more Epstein revelations in the news.
But like I said, this is the very best case scenario. Most likely Trump will just be to busy handling an investigation and an adversarial Congress to do much but make noise on social media.
Vance is of a generation where he lived a good chunk of his life on social media and his mobile phone, so embarassing secrets could be picked up more easily by nation-level actors. It's possible that any politician of this generation in any country in any political party might be more susceptible to blackmail than the geriatric generation represented by Trump.
Vance is very isolationist and anti-Europe. He has said his proudest achievement is stopping aid to Ukraine. He says he wants peace but the implication is through the surrender of Ukraine. He is seen as worse than Trump.
I’m not sure anything is worse than Trump. He’s an amazing case study of a complete incompetent that somehow has a solid base of supporters. It’s baffling to me as I’ve always thought he was a crass blowhard and I fundamentally cannot understand his appeal.
You aren't deadlast, you are dead wrong. On every point.
The Ukrainian war never stopped. Russia has never paused attacking for even one day, in more years than WWI. The War on Ukraine never went away and so can't "come back"
No one supporting Ukraine is supporting a foreign dictator. Zelenskyy was elected in a free and fair election, and elections have been involuntarily suspended while the country is under continuous bombardment targeting civilians. Holding an election would be literal suicide and condemning voters to death by announcing every time and place where people would gather, just to make it easy for Russia to target them. And there is ZERO question — Ukrainian civilian casualties are NOT collateral damage, they are deliberately targeted by Russian missiles, long-range drones, and individual civilians are even hunted by FPV drones in "human safari" incidents posted by Russians themselves.
Ukrainians are only defending their own right to live on their own land under their own government, and not have their children kidnapped and their neighbors and themselves tortured and slaughtered, which has happened in EVERY city Russia occupied. Russia is doing what Russia has always done — invade and genocide a neighbor, then say "this was always Russia".
It is absolutely disgusting that you come here to post such lies and characterize any support for Ukraine as if it were support for an autocracy, when YOU are the one supporting Russia's autocracy. You are factually wrong and morally abhorrent. Rethink your life.
If they can pull them out, they can also drop fresh ones down.
Not sure if that is better than just using a helicopter however.
> Not sure if that is better than just using a helicopter however.
Anyone who has done first responder training should have had it drilled into their skulls to remember the number one rule .... "do not add yourself to the injury list".
If you're operating in a war-zone its kind of the same thing. Send in a helicopter to drop off one or more guys and you are also sending in bare minimum of one extra person but realistically almost certainly three extra people (two at the front and one at the back to watch the people jumping out).
Also drones are probably somewhat cheaper than helicopters. Both to buy and to operate.
Probably harder to hit six single-soldier carrying drones than one helicopter.
Can not see the drone and shoot it down using thermal camera or ir seeking missile
It reaffirms that Ukrainians are:
1. very advanced with drones 2. caring about their soldiers
Disclaimer: I am a proud Ukrainian.
[flagged]
Please don't post political/ideological rhetoric on HN. It doesn't matter how correct your position is or how correct you feel it is; it only leads to back and forth arguments between people on opposing sides, and that's just what we're trying to avoid. Please aim for curious conversation at all times here. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
The curious thing is America has become a Russian ally:
https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cxr5yvzv7rp0o
That’s an issue that can be debated at the appropriate time and place, but it’s not the topic of this article, so it’s a generic tangent and flamebait, which the guidelines specifically ask us to avoid.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kompromat
>Use of kompromat has been common in the politics of Russia[7] and other post-Soviet states
Surely they wouldn't do the things that they usually do with Trump, who visited Russia in 1987 upon invitation by, more or less clearly, the KGB?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Links_between_Trump_associates...
I wish “even Republicans” but that party stands for nothing any more, it isn’t even conservative. It’s the most bizarre and morally bankrupt thing I’ve seen in American politics and I’ve been paying attention since the 80s.
No need for dirt. Putin simply funnels money to Trump and that's enough.
> even Republicans are beginning to wonder what dirt Putin has on Trump.
What dirt could they possibly have on him that would actually matter to the voters that voted for him last time?
Not trolling or rhetorical; that's a completely sincere question. Even if something "bad" were to surface, his supporters would simply deny it and/or ignore it, same as they've done for all the other things he's done that are already known.
You can pretty much divide American voters into two camps right now: the ones who loathe him and the ones who DGAF (non-voting voters being in the latter category).
> What dirt could they possibly have on him that would actually matter to the voters that voted for him last time?
Some segment will always deny any dirt that comes out but I think most would become fairly adverse to him if, say, conclusive evidence of child sexual abuse surfaced.
Today in Kharkiv, a Russian drone killed a baby in a stroller and two women, injuring 7 others. [0]
Meanwhile, Musk and Trump are pointing figures at each about who set the speed limit on Starlink/shield terminals, which apparently affects interceptors. The USA also stopped giving Ukraine ballistic missile warnings.
[0] https://x.com/United24media/status/2112192976055140726
Active discussion: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=50155237
NGL, reading this gave me the feels...
Also, next wartime invention: air mines.
The German company Avilus has shown a medevac drone, I don't know if it's been used to transport a live human (even uninjured) for a test yet.
https://www.xponential-europe.com/en/Media_News/Magazine/Art...
https://www.google.com/search?num=10&client=firefox-b-d&hs=p...
Was it two years ago, or even longer, that Akhmat troops claimed Ukrainian drones tried to abduct their men in the field? Who knows, it might end up actually happen one day. Wild.
Pretty horrifying prospect really. Imagine the buzzing of a huge drone descending upon you from nowhere, before it just grabs you with its metal arms, and whisks you away into the sky, lol.
Guess it's better than dropping nades on top of you, maybe :/
It wouldn't need to drop grenades. It could pick you up, fly high enough, and drop you to your death. Never runs out of ammo, just batteries.
This is pretty horrifying. Bonus points if you hit somebody on the way down?
If a drone wanted to kill you, it would use a bullet. Cheapest and easiest way, with the least risk to the drone.
The extraction case would only be for high-value targets (enemy military/economic/political leaders), where having them alive would give leverage on having them order their organizations to do something useful for the drone owner.
Bullets are probably more economical.
for the Russian soldiers, it would certainly be a better fate than remaining on the field for a few more tens of minutes before they die (on average). AFAICT, they are treated better in Ukrainian POW camps than in the Russian deployed positions
Depends.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Torture_of_Russian_soldiers_in...
Right, highlight the one incident on the Ukrainian side vs the standard war-crimes treatment by the Russians, and yes, there are also a number of incidents during capture on the both sides.
Also note the mismatch in POWs died in captivity returned by Ukraine (14) vs by Russia (>1000, as of [0]).
And note the overall condition of Russian soldiers returned is well-fed, and Ukrainians returned are barely walking.
It has been some 400 years since Cardinal Richelieu said "If you give me six lines written by the hand of the most honest of men, I will find something in them which will hang him." [1] We can always find an exception to condemn someone.
Our task is instead to try to get a fair grasp on what is happening. Highlighting the exceptional event out of context is not helpful
[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prisoners_of_war_in_the_Russo-...
[1] https://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Cardinal_Richelieu
edit: completed last paragraph; accidentally posted incomplete
As a Ukrainian, I really wish my country could innovate in areas other than evacuation of wounded people from our own soil.
They are many... you should be proud. I am.
https://ukraine.ua/invest-trade/ukrainian-inventions-that-ch...
And the recent drone tech is saving many lives and lots of money.
From outside it seems that Ukraine is not really given a choice right now but to defend itself. I wish for a soon end to the war so your beautiful country can prosper again and your people can start healing.
I think the poster's point was, "Imagine what we could be applying our ingenuity to if the bastards invading us would only piss off."
Doesn't this have potential applications in disaster relief?
https://inkorr.com/en/litna-zinka-v-kostantinivci-napisala-v...
https://duckduckgo.com/?q=ukrainian+woman+writes+i+ask+for+b...
A woman wrote "I ask for bread" in the snow in front of her house. A passing drone photographed it. This led to a later mission to air drop food to her.
is this not a good innovation?
It is a good innovation in the same way a shield is a good innovation. Perhaps people do not always want to innovate in the area of war, but instead doing something else, but they are forced to innovate like this.
it also feels like it could be a replacement to the electric scooter at some point?
drone pickup is basically a jet pack
Now it looks like the Democrats are going to win the Ukraine war is back on for Europe. Like we want another war to support some foreign dictator.
Supporting Ukraine’s defense against invasion has had better ROI than most domestic defense spending. For a pittance we’ve let a major adversary weaken itself considerably. We should do more.
Confusing comment. What foreign dictator are you referring to?
Well, there's just one dictator involved, Putin. Trump is supporting him right now.
Russia apologists consider Zelensky a dictator installed by “The West” and use the same verbiage of stolen elections as Trumpists
“Back on”? When did it stop?
I think the European countries' leadership are well aware that if Russia is not decisively defeated in Ukraine now, returning every square meter of UA territory back to Ukrainian control, they'll be fighting the Russian army in actual NATO locations even further west in 2, 5 or 7 years from now.
Europe are already fighting Russia. Russia has made scores of "hybrid war" attacks throughout Europe and GB, including attempted bomb-laden drones at Leipzeig airport, cutting numerous undersea cables, and even "errant" drone attacks. They are also likely behind amplifying the current unrest in France.
EU politicians don't want to acknowledge the ongoing war because they think it would be an escalation and they also have a fear of 'Russia breaking up'. Other than the Baltic states, they don't realize the only way to stop it is push back, hard and fast, as Ukraine is doing. The Russian military is low-capability and declining, reliant now on North Korea and Iran, and the economy is sliding. The reality is little could be better than Russia breaking up and finally abandoning it's imperial ambitions, which are still active today.
They probably will, but they won't get the votes to override a presidential veto (2/3 of both chambers). The very best case scenario is that Trump is impeached and Vance doesn't have any serious kompromat.
isn't impeachment without removal just a bullet point on a wikipedia page? i don't see it being very much of a deterrent.
It's possible that enough Republicans will be looking for a clean break with Trump and may be willing to get Vance in his place, especially with Trump's recent dealings with Russia and Ukraine. The MAGA voting base is looking less devoted with the recent economic developments as well and might not be so keen on his candidates in 2029. Also, if dems get the majority we may be seeing more Epstein revelations in the news.
But like I said, this is the very best case scenario. Most likely Trump will just be to busy handling an investigation and an adversarial Congress to do much but make noise on social media.
Vance is of a generation where he lived a good chunk of his life on social media and his mobile phone, so embarassing secrets could be picked up more easily by nation-level actors. It's possible that any politician of this generation in any country in any political party might be more susceptible to blackmail than the geriatric generation represented by Trump.
There are degrees to kompromat. He probably wasn't close friends with Epstein for instance.
Vance is very isolationist and anti-Europe. He has said his proudest achievement is stopping aid to Ukraine. He says he wants peace but the implication is through the surrender of Ukraine. He is seen as worse than Trump.
I’m not sure anything is worse than Trump. He’s an amazing case study of a complete incompetent that somehow has a solid base of supporters. It’s baffling to me as I’ve always thought he was a crass blowhard and I fundamentally cannot understand his appeal.
What do you mean "The Ukraine war is back on for Europe?"
You aren't deadlast, you are dead wrong. On every point.
The Ukrainian war never stopped. Russia has never paused attacking for even one day, in more years than WWI. The War on Ukraine never went away and so can't "come back"
No one supporting Ukraine is supporting a foreign dictator. Zelenskyy was elected in a free and fair election, and elections have been involuntarily suspended while the country is under continuous bombardment targeting civilians. Holding an election would be literal suicide and condemning voters to death by announcing every time and place where people would gather, just to make it easy for Russia to target them. And there is ZERO question — Ukrainian civilian casualties are NOT collateral damage, they are deliberately targeted by Russian missiles, long-range drones, and individual civilians are even hunted by FPV drones in "human safari" incidents posted by Russians themselves.
Ukrainians are only defending their own right to live on their own land under their own government, and not have their children kidnapped and their neighbors and themselves tortured and slaughtered, which has happened in EVERY city Russia occupied. Russia is doing what Russia has always done — invade and genocide a neighbor, then say "this was always Russia".
It is absolutely disgusting that you come here to post such lies and characterize any support for Ukraine as if it were support for an autocracy, when YOU are the one supporting Russia's autocracy. You are factually wrong and morally abhorrent. Rethink your life.