Making Deep Learning Go Brrrr from First Principles (2022)

(horace.io)

119 points | by tosh 8 hours ago ago

20 comments

  • marketingan 3 hours ago ago

    Deep learning is just glorified linear algebra. Master the progression: Feed-forward CNN RNN LSTM Attention. You don't even need a GPU to understand the climax; Karpathy’s llama2.c implements a full transformer inference engine in just ~300 lines of C using SIMD pragmas for CPU execution.

    • miki123211 2 hours ago ago

      I wish more people pursued that approach to teaching neural networks.

      First teach what the network does and why, writing it as a loopy, inference-only Python function. Explain training only in an abstract way, E.G. with the "take a random weight, twist it a little and see if the loss improves" algorithm. This lets you focus on the architecture and on why it is what it is.

      Then, teach the intuitions behind derivatives and gradient descent. You don't need the entirety of calculus, there's no benefit to knowing how a sequence or limit works if you ) only want to understand neural networks. With autograd, you won't be manually doing derivatives of weird functions either, so intuitive understanding is a lot more important than doing dozens of traditional calculus exercises on paper like it's the 1800s. You could probably explain the little bit of calculus you need in an hour or two, even to somebody with a 12-year-old's understanding of math and a good bit of programming knowledge.

      Only when people understand the training and inference, implemented with loops and descriptive variable names, teach the tensor, explain how a modern CPU and GPU works (because many programmers still think a modern computer is just a much faster 6502), and then teach the tricks we use to make it fast.

  • ollin 3 hours ago ago

    This post is a classic! Also recommended: Horace also gave a related talk (covering the high-level picture of modern ML Systems) at Jane Street in Dec 2024 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=139UPjoq7Kw

  • tosh 7 hours ago ago

    > in the time that Python can perform a single FLOP, an A100 could have chewed through 9.75 million FLOPS

    wild

    • patmorgan23 7 hours ago ago

      Why are we comparing a programing language and a GPU. This is a category error. Programing languages do not do any operations. They perform no FLOPs, they are the thing the FLOPs are performing.

      "The I7-4770K and preform 20k more Flops than C++" is an equally sensible statement (i.e. not)

    • p1esk 7 hours ago ago

      This statement makes zero sense

    • tosh 6 hours ago ago

      re comments:

      yes of course this is apples to oranges but that's kind of the point

      it shows the vast span between specialized hardware throughput IFF you can use an A100 at its limit vs overhead of one of the most popular programming languages in use today that eventually does the "same thing" on a CPU

      the interesting thing is why that is so

      CPU vs GPU (latency vs throughput), boxing vs dense representation, interpreter overhead, scalar execution, layers upon layers, …

    • itishappy 5 hours ago ago

      Which, lets be honest, is probably still being orchestrated by Python somewhere.

      Python is 9.75 million times faster than Python.

    • xyzsparetimexyz 7 hours ago ago

      Single core vs multi core accounts for much of this

  • ThouYS 2 hours ago ago

    I feel like there is no portable advice for performance. A torch model exported as onnx is a different model.

    That onnx model run using onnxruntime with cuda ep is a different model than the one run with TRT ep.

    And even among the same runtime, depending on the target hardware and the memory available during tuning, the model behaves differently. It is a humongous mess

  • big-chungus4 3 hours ago ago

    How does x.cos().cos() work faster than doing two cos calls separately? Like the first cos call returns a tensor either way, the only difference is that it's not assigned to a variable. But how is it even possible know that difference in python?

    • vrm 3 hours ago ago

      It’s really not a concept you can express in idiomatic Python very easily. This comes from the actual generated assembly involving copies from global GPU memory into registers (slow, bandwidth saturates quickly) and back in between the cosines. If you can avoid the intermediate roundtrip that cuts the cost approximately in half.

    • ollin 3 hours ago ago

      Yeah, that part should not be read literally; `x.cos().cos()` and `x1 = x.cos(); x2 = x1.cos()` both launch the same number of kernels (two in unfused/eager mode, one in fused/torch.compile, see this test notebook [1]). I think the author chained the two cos calls to symbolize the idea of combining them (without exposing the intermediate result), but chaining the two cos calls doesn't literally trigger operator fusion.

      [1] https://colab.research.google.com/drive/13a4Y-ko6QLMPAhBz64c...

  • noosphr 7 hours ago ago

    >For example, getting good performance on a dataset with deep learning also involves a lot of guesswork. But, if your training loss is way lower than your test loss, you're in the "overfitting" regime, and you're wasting your time if you try to increase the capacity of your model.

    https://arxiv.org/abs/1912.02292

    • appplication 7 hours ago ago

      Generally, posting a link-only reply without further elaboration comes across as a bit rude. Are you providing support for the above point? Refuting it? You felt compelled to comment, a few words to indicate what you’re actually trying to say would go a long way.

  • axpy906 3 hours ago ago

    Needs 2022 in title

  • jdw64 7 hours ago ago

    Right now, all I know how to do is pull models from Hugging Face, but someday I want to build my own small LLM from scratch

    • max-amb 6 hours ago ago

      If you want a written resource I have a blog post about the mathematics behind building a feed forward from scratch, https://max-amb.github.io/blog/the_maths_behind_the_mlp/. Kinda focuses on translation from individual components to matrix operations.

    • kflansburg 6 hours ago ago

      If you aren't already aware, Karpathy has several videos that could get you there in a few hours https://www.youtube.com/@AndrejKarpathy

    • glouwbug 7 hours ago ago

      It’s just linear algebra. Work your way from feed forward to CNN to RNN to LSTM to attention then maybe a small inference engine. Kaparthy’s llama2.c is only ~300 lines on the latter and it pragma simds so you don’t need fancy GPUs