The UK's tier 2 and the EU's blue card are strictly better than the US H-1B to green card mechanism and have been for over a decade. You face no 7% per country capping on naturalization. Has it worked out? These visas look like O-1 competitors more than anything, not H-1B.
The issue is EU salaries (and the subsequent income tax) simply aren't attractive for most Indian, Chinese, and Koreans engineers in the US - the primary beneficiaries of the H1B program.
The only way a European office can attract Asian American talent on a work visa is to offer a salary comparable to the US, just like what the London offices for Google, Citadel, and Bloomberg do.
Otherwise, they can demand EU level salaries in their home market.
For an Indian on an H1B and working for FAANG, the choice isn't Palo Alto versus Berlin, it's the Palo Alto versus Hyderabad, Bangalore, or Pune.
Basically, the H1B change is causing a reverse brain drain back to Asia now now becuase there is an incentive to fully offshore instead of keeping mixed teams in the US.
I know at least 4 partners at the Indian entities of American VC funds already releasing an open call for startups for any Indian American who wants to return to India after the announcement this weekend, or to pair them with their portfolio companies in India.
> These visas look like O-1 competitors more than anything, not H-1B.
Not really. An O-1 is annoying and difficult to process, and does target a different persona than a blue card.
I’ve worked for big tech in the Silicon Valley, worked for big tech in NYC, worked for big tech in Berlin. Though I make way less money here in Germany, I’d never move back to the US.
The money makes up for being far away from family as well as homesickness.
Living in the EU means you are far away from family as well with the added negative that unless you're Vietnamese in CEE and Paris, Fujianese in Central Italy, or Mirpuri in Scandinavia, there isn't a large Asian community in most EU states.
If I want Sikkimese, Pahari, Marathi, Chettinad, Maithili, or some other ethnic group's cultural services, cuisine, and/or goods I can always find that represented in American tech hubs. On the other hand it's nonexistent in Europe.
I think you're of European heritage, so for you your cultural heritage's goods, services, and cuisine are well represented across Europe. That isn't true for Indians, Chinese (China is not a monoculture), and Koreans.
For Indian, Chinese, and Korean nationals on a work visa in the US, you can earn a European salary in the old country while being close to family. This is why Europe is not enticing, because immigration is hard and if the only incentive is to have a lower take home, then there's no reason to go to Europe.
I’m also living a 15h flight away from my country/culture/people and I never felt the need for money to make up for it. Sounds like you just value money?
Also Berlin, Paris, Amsterdam et all are large, diverse metropolises. Not sure where the idea comes from that you wouldn’t be able to find your tribe or your cuisine in these cities.
Most Indians in Germany are primarily from Maharashtra or Punjab.
And those numbers are minuscule compared to the diaspora in the UK, let alone Australia, New Zealand, and Canada which are all much more friendly to Asians than Europe.
> Also Berlin, Paris, Amsterdam et all are large, diverse metropolises. Not sure where the idea comes from that you wouldn’t be able to find your tribe or your cuisine in these cities.
Because they do not. The only European country with a large Indian diaspora is the UK, and that disaspora is overwhelmingly just Gujarati and Punjabi. Same for overseas Chinese and the Korean diaspora as well.
What worked for you is good for you, but the culture shift for someone from much of Asia to the EU is severe compared to the US where Asian immigration has been the norm for over a century.
> Sounds like you just value money?
Why leave India or China to earn a €70k salary when you can demand the same in Hyderabad or Hangzhou? Why move from Palo Alto to Paris, when you can move back to Pune or Pudong and earn the exact same, while also not facing culture shock and being close to family.
Also, having to become fluent in a French or German or Dutch or some other European language that isn't English is a severe blocker in much of Asia - where English is prioritized.
> Because Europe offers clean safe cities and good WLB
So does Australia and New Zealand.
And you are much closer to family as a result and in a countries where Asians are well represented and with the added bonus that they are Anglophone countries so no need to learn German, French, or some other European language that isn't English.
Look, Germany is a good country, but it legitimately isn't enticing for the kind of Indian or Chinese national who came to the US on a work visa.
> If all you want is to be in a big Indian diaspora and make a lot of money then I guess California is a good fit for you. Glad you like it
That's what most diasporas want. Look at the statistics of where the Indian, Chinese, and Korean diaspora are clustered. Amongst western countries it's overwhelmingly North America, Australia, and the UK
> then I guess California is a good fit for you
It is. I've been here since I was 1 years old when my parents were part of the initial work visa expansion in the 90s which brought tens of thousands of us Indian, Chinese, and Korean Americans to the US.
If I were to leave, I'd probably go to Singapore because I can take advantage of Asian dealflow while remaining in an Anglophone country where we are overrepresented.
I think if someone forfeits stability for money then that's their choice. I personally think that's an extremely strange one to make, but I'm one of those people who left the US for more stability, safety, so maybe I'm biased.
I really don't know why are you are getting so worked up about this.
At a macro level, the majority of Asian diasporas in the Western world are in North America, Australia, the UK, and New Zealand.
All I'm saying is for the majority of Asians, mainland Europe just doesn't have the same pull factor that the Anglophone has because we have never had a significant population in Europe.
It's the same way a management consultant with roots in Turkiye or Morocco will be biased to work in Frankfurt instead of NY simply because there's a massive pre-existing community no matter where you go in Germany and they will be close to family in Turkiye.
Depends on the kind of candidate. The brain drain already kind of started reversing in the 2008-12 period during those layoffs, and Indian tech salaries caught up with Eastern Europe (and the US at the top end of the bracket) by the early 2020s.
A large portion of Indians who came to the US on an H1B over the last decade basically came to the US in order to use the American experience to paper over issues with their resumes (eg. Didn't major in CS, didn't attend an INI, worked at a WITCH) causing their careers to stagnate.
Being in the US still conveys bragging rights, but increasingly the older generations recognize that someone immigrating abroad will basically almost never meet their parents again aside for a couple weeks a year.
As such, the name of the game now is to work in the US for a couple years and then become a PM Director or Director of Engineering at a GCC in India.
Additionally, Indian founders in the US have started considering IPOing in Indian equity markets instead of the US because the tech IPO market is (edit: relatively) dead here in North America (especially if you cannot show $400M+ in revenue) but showing $50M-$100M can guarantee you a $500M-$2B IPOs like Pine Labs' listing a couple days ago. There are at least 25 Indian startups in the process of IPOing this year [0] and the trend is continuing [1].
So for entrepreneurial Indians, the US is slowly starting to lose it's shine.
And finally, as an Indian STEM academic in the US, you can get a $100K public-private startup grant if you move your lab to India, and INIs in India (the Indian equivalent of Double First Class universities in China) allow academic staff to work with private sector players without demanding convluted IP partnerships. Thus, a lot of American-educated Indian academics in India are also becoming angel and seed investors, and have helped guide startups into YCombinator or raising a round from an Accel.
From a European perspective, the best example would probably be the reverse brain drain Poland and Czechia saw in the 2016-19 period, Israel in the early 2000s, and China in the 2010s.
There were 165 IPOs in the U.S. public markets in the first half of 2025. This was 76% higher than the 94 IPOs in the first half of 2024 and is estimated to be 47% higher than the total number of IPOs in 2024 when annualized for the full year of 2025.
I said just for the tech industry, and the multipliers are extremely difficult if you cannot show $400M in revenue. I'd recommend looking at some of Jamin Ball's analysis.
And comparing with 2024 is not great, because activity is still well below what we saw before the interest rate hike [0]
The IPO window is starting to reopen, but it's still somewhat closed compared to the norm from a couple years ago, and Sailpoint's lackluster IPO has dampened the mood along with CoreWeave's lackluster performance as a public company due to constant misses.
A lot of companies are in the process of building IPO readiness, but ime there is still some amount of hesitancy, becuase no one wants to be the first one to roll the dice, but I think Netskope's performance so far might help assuage worries.
The UK's tier 2 and the EU's blue card are strictly better than the US H-1B to green card mechanism and have been for over a decade. You face no 7% per country capping on naturalization. Has it worked out? These visas look like O-1 competitors more than anything, not H-1B.
The issue is EU salaries (and the subsequent income tax) simply aren't attractive for most Indian, Chinese, and Koreans engineers in the US - the primary beneficiaries of the H1B program.
The only way a European office can attract Asian American talent on a work visa is to offer a salary comparable to the US, just like what the London offices for Google, Citadel, and Bloomberg do.
Otherwise, they can demand EU level salaries in their home market.
For an Indian on an H1B and working for FAANG, the choice isn't Palo Alto versus Berlin, it's the Palo Alto versus Hyderabad, Bangalore, or Pune.
Basically, the H1B change is causing a reverse brain drain back to Asia now now becuase there is an incentive to fully offshore instead of keeping mixed teams in the US.
I know at least 4 partners at the Indian entities of American VC funds already releasing an open call for startups for any Indian American who wants to return to India after the announcement this weekend, or to pair them with their portfolio companies in India.
> These visas look like O-1 competitors more than anything, not H-1B.
Not really. An O-1 is annoying and difficult to process, and does target a different persona than a blue card.
There’s more to life than money.
I’ve worked for big tech in the Silicon Valley, worked for big tech in NYC, worked for big tech in Berlin. Though I make way less money here in Germany, I’d never move back to the US.
The money makes up for being far away from family as well as homesickness.
Living in the EU means you are far away from family as well with the added negative that unless you're Vietnamese in CEE and Paris, Fujianese in Central Italy, or Mirpuri in Scandinavia, there isn't a large Asian community in most EU states.
If I want Sikkimese, Pahari, Marathi, Chettinad, Maithili, or some other ethnic group's cultural services, cuisine, and/or goods I can always find that represented in American tech hubs. On the other hand it's nonexistent in Europe.
I think you're of European heritage, so for you your cultural heritage's goods, services, and cuisine are well represented across Europe. That isn't true for Indians, Chinese (China is not a monoculture), and Koreans.
For Indian, Chinese, and Korean nationals on a work visa in the US, you can earn a European salary in the old country while being close to family. This is why Europe is not enticing, because immigration is hard and if the only incentive is to have a lower take home, then there's no reason to go to Europe.
I’m also living a 15h flight away from my country/culture/people and I never felt the need for money to make up for it. Sounds like you just value money?
Also Berlin, Paris, Amsterdam et all are large, diverse metropolises. Not sure where the idea comes from that you wouldn’t be able to find your tribe or your cuisine in these cities.
Yeah, in June 2024, there were 37 120 Indian citizens in Berlin, https://download.statistik-berlin-brandenburg.de/60c6e60ee05... and in June 2025 already 45 189, https://download.statistik-berlin-brandenburg.de/ec900887845... about 1.2% of the total population. Clearly they found it enticing enough.
Most Indians in Germany are primarily from Maharashtra or Punjab.
And those numbers are minuscule compared to the diaspora in the UK, let alone Australia, New Zealand, and Canada which are all much more friendly to Asians than Europe.
> Also Berlin, Paris, Amsterdam et all are large, diverse metropolises. Not sure where the idea comes from that you wouldn’t be able to find your tribe or your cuisine in these cities.
Because they do not. The only European country with a large Indian diaspora is the UK, and that disaspora is overwhelmingly just Gujarati and Punjabi. Same for overseas Chinese and the Korean diaspora as well.
What worked for you is good for you, but the culture shift for someone from much of Asia to the EU is severe compared to the US where Asian immigration has been the norm for over a century.
> Sounds like you just value money?
Why leave India or China to earn a €70k salary when you can demand the same in Hyderabad or Hangzhou? Why move from Palo Alto to Paris, when you can move back to Pune or Pudong and earn the exact same, while also not facing culture shock and being close to family.
Also, having to become fluent in a French or German or Dutch or some other European language that isn't English is a severe blocker in much of Asia - where English is prioritized.
Because Europe offers clean safe cities and good WLB? Again you’re just looking at it from the angle of money…
If all you want is to be in a big Indian diaspora and make a lot of money then I guess California is a good fit for you. Glad you like it!
> Because Europe offers clean safe cities and good WLB
So does Australia and New Zealand.
And you are much closer to family as a result and in a countries where Asians are well represented and with the added bonus that they are Anglophone countries so no need to learn German, French, or some other European language that isn't English.
Look, Germany is a good country, but it legitimately isn't enticing for the kind of Indian or Chinese national who came to the US on a work visa.
> If all you want is to be in a big Indian diaspora and make a lot of money then I guess California is a good fit for you. Glad you like it
That's what most diasporas want. Look at the statistics of where the Indian, Chinese, and Korean diaspora are clustered. Amongst western countries it's overwhelmingly North America, Australia, and the UK
> then I guess California is a good fit for you
It is. I've been here since I was 1 years old when my parents were part of the initial work visa expansion in the 90s which brought tens of thousands of us Indian, Chinese, and Korean Americans to the US.
If I were to leave, I'd probably go to Singapore because I can take advantage of Asian dealflow while remaining in an Anglophone country where we are overrepresented.
I think if someone forfeits stability for money then that's their choice. I personally think that's an extremely strange one to make, but I'm one of those people who left the US for more stability, safety, so maybe I'm biased.
I really don't know why are you are getting so worked up about this.
At a macro level, the majority of Asian diasporas in the Western world are in North America, Australia, the UK, and New Zealand.
All I'm saying is for the majority of Asians, mainland Europe just doesn't have the same pull factor that the Anglophone has because we have never had a significant population in Europe.
It's the same way a management consultant with roots in Turkiye or Morocco will be biased to work in Frankfurt instead of NY simply because there's a massive pre-existing community no matter where you go in Germany and they will be close to family in Turkiye.
Will Indians be happy with that? I live in a European country which used to have a brain drain to the US and the main reasons to go were:
a) Money being much more than you could get in Europe
b) Bragging rights - especially for parents
I imagine for Indians it's something similar?
Depends on the kind of candidate. The brain drain already kind of started reversing in the 2008-12 period during those layoffs, and Indian tech salaries caught up with Eastern Europe (and the US at the top end of the bracket) by the early 2020s.
A large portion of Indians who came to the US on an H1B over the last decade basically came to the US in order to use the American experience to paper over issues with their resumes (eg. Didn't major in CS, didn't attend an INI, worked at a WITCH) causing their careers to stagnate.
Being in the US still conveys bragging rights, but increasingly the older generations recognize that someone immigrating abroad will basically almost never meet their parents again aside for a couple weeks a year.
As such, the name of the game now is to work in the US for a couple years and then become a PM Director or Director of Engineering at a GCC in India.
Additionally, Indian founders in the US have started considering IPOing in Indian equity markets instead of the US because the tech IPO market is (edit: relatively) dead here in North America (especially if you cannot show $400M+ in revenue) but showing $50M-$100M can guarantee you a $500M-$2B IPOs like Pine Labs' listing a couple days ago. There are at least 25 Indian startups in the process of IPOing this year [0] and the trend is continuing [1].
So for entrepreneurial Indians, the US is slowly starting to lose it's shine.
And finally, as an Indian STEM academic in the US, you can get a $100K public-private startup grant if you move your lab to India, and INIs in India (the Indian equivalent of Double First Class universities in China) allow academic staff to work with private sector players without demanding convluted IP partnerships. Thus, a lot of American-educated Indian academics in India are also becoming angel and seed investors, and have helped guide startups into YCombinator or raising a round from an Accel.
From a European perspective, the best example would probably be the reverse brain drain Poland and Czechia saw in the 2016-19 period, Israel in the early 2000s, and China in the 2010s.
[0] - https://inc42.com/features/indian-startup-ipo-tracker-2025/
[1] - https://www.goldmansachs.com/insights/articles/will-indias-i...
There were 165 IPOs in the U.S. public markets in the first half of 2025. This was 76% higher than the 94 IPOs in the first half of 2024 and is estimated to be 47% higher than the total number of IPOs in 2024 when annualized for the full year of 2025.
Far from being basically dead
I said just for the tech industry, and the multipliers are extremely difficult if you cannot show $400M in revenue. I'd recommend looking at some of Jamin Ball's analysis.
And comparing with 2024 is not great, because activity is still well below what we saw before the interest rate hike [0]
The IPO window is starting to reopen, but it's still somewhat closed compared to the norm from a couple years ago, and Sailpoint's lackluster IPO has dampened the mood along with CoreWeave's lackluster performance as a public company due to constant misses.
A lot of companies are in the process of building IPO readiness, but ime there is still some amount of hesitancy, becuase no one wants to be the first one to roll the dice, but I think Netskope's performance so far might help assuage worries.
[0] - https://www.spglobal.com/market-intelligence/en/news-insight...
[dead]