Theoretically a very good development regarding lawfulness and accountability.
State spies are basically illegals without accountability, like the various mafia networks. (CIA did have close connections to the Italian mafia, btw in their various illegal activities, such as drugs and torture. The NSA is regularly above the constitution.) Private spies are not yet connected like the mafia, but still can get caught operating out of the legal or constitutional boundaries.
Looking at the past 10 years of the software industry, I still can't wrap my head around the approach that most large companies have taken to hiring software engineers; treating them as literal cogs in the machine, designing processes which place trust in the hands of middle managers and bureaucrats instead of engineers. There was literally no vetting process for engineers. Now every corner of the internet is full of viruses, spyware and backdoors and of course middle managers had no idea. Nobody is responsible for the software so it belongs to intelligence agencies and hackers.
The software industry turned out so different from how I thought it would. When I decided to pursue it as a career, I thought that software engineers would be treated and given responsibilities like managers.
It's crazy when you think about it; managers are responsible for their people, whom they have limited control over... Yet software engineers have zero responsibility for the software they produce, which they have almost full control over.
I was a private yacht chef for 7 years. They would hire anyone off the street to work on a $35,000,000 private yacht without checking references or a background check. I had unprecedented access to CEO's of Fortune 100 companies and phone numbers of a couple billionaires on my phone. I thought about writing a spy novel where a bunch of college students got entry level jobs on a yacht and used the access to plant bugs. The plot is they get caught and have to escape the Caribbean while being chased.
1. A group of EECS graduates get jobs as deckhands and stewardesses on mega yachts in order to bug the yachts to glean information for trading securities.
2. They install computers in the electronics cave below the wheelhouses because nobody knows what most of the electronics there do in the first place.
Today there are hundreds of mega yachts in Fort Lauderdale, Florida with thousands of unscreened workers maintaining the yachts before they leave in November for a season of cruising and charters in the Caribbean.
3. They get caught by Russian mafia while in Martinique or St. Lucia.
4. They MacGyver their way out of the Caribbean while being chased by thugs with unlimited resources.
In almost every industry this is the case. Perhaps with the exception of some government contractors.
Even with projects that went to extreme cost to maintain secrecy ultimately failed to do so, IE the Manhattan project.
Most tech companies (and non-tech companies) take a fairly pragmatic approach. Generally trust your employees but configure systems with an audit trail so you can hold them accountable later for malicious actions. If accidental, there's not much you can do anyway so just buy insurance.
A couple of years ago, a dipshit moron in the US Army leaked a bunch of top secret documents on Discord, mostly related to the Ukrainian war.
The thing is, these documents were kinda bad. The information in them was not any better than the work of open source intelligence, and analyses were as good (bad) as that of many armchair analysts.
So it's no wonder that spy agencies are getting left behind.
To be clear, CIA and other agencies probably have HUMINT sources that are still ahead of the open source intelligence.
Their SIGINT is likely still ahead as well, although even that advantage is fading. During the Ukrainian conflict, we were able to track the activities of the armies by using NASA's publicly available infrared brush fire tracker satellites (FIRMS - https://firms.modaps.eosdis.nasa.gov/map/#d:24hrs;@38.1,48.0... ). And you can literally pay $100 and get a picture of any area on the planet, with a resolution that is good enough to track vehicles.
I don't understand why your comment is being retrieved so unpopularily thus far.
The decline in quality that you're describing not withstanding, I'm not surprised that private intelligence companies are on the rise as opposed to state agencies. I reckon that won't be for long though and that eventually any distinction between the two will be nominal.
> I'm not surprised that private intelligence companies are on the rise as opposed to state agencies
Me, neither. The private sector almost universally pays more for top talent, so much of the top talent will go there. It's also probably a better culture.
As more government agencies outsource intelligence (and consequently, decision-making) to the private sector, companies like Palantir and OpenAI will become even more the de-facto government than they already are.
> As more government agencies outsource intelligence (and consequently, decision-making) to the private sector, companies like Palantir and OpenAI will become even more the de-facto government than they already are.
This is basically what I was alluding to. The stage is set all too well for this not to occur.
I predict we’ll head to a Holy Roman Empire or Snow Crash style of federated fragmented powers that in aggregate we can call The United States but in reality it’s a bunch of jockeying nobles and oligarchs.
Maybe it always was, and the US Revolution was to allow this by tearing down unitary monarch power.
The problem with said situation is that being big is such a winning move post-industrialization, even before divide and conquer shenanigans to play at 'colonizing India'. Fractal balkanization isn't exactly a winning move and there is a reason why a unified Germany became a significant power above and beyond its most bellicose states.
I'm following the war pretty closely, and the documents basically added no real analysis compared to the open source intelligence community (Christo Grozev, Conflict Intelligence Team, Oryx). E.g. their analysis of Wagner group was inferior to the one published by investigative journalists.
I’d prefer a neutral account. In conclusion, is it fair to say that the leak was a breach of US protocol or law and was publicly-available information?
Their post is somehow even worse quality than the stuff they’re complaining about. To answer your question, a lot of the documents were vehicle/weapon data, thickness of armor plates of tanks and such. Specifically regarding what is best searched as “War Thunder Discord leaks”, as it was, supposedly, a bunch of War Thunder players trying to one-up each other on how knowledgeable they were on military hardware. Some of them (there were a good handful over the years) are detailed here: https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?l=polish...
War Thunder are to my knowledge the only game studio who have had to publicly tell their fans not to send them classified material in order to advocate for a balance change.
Sounding like a broken record here. Your bank and state government will sell your data to these brokers. Just in case any of you think your TOR browser saves you.
Theoretically a very good development regarding lawfulness and accountability.
State spies are basically illegals without accountability, like the various mafia networks. (CIA did have close connections to the Italian mafia, btw in their various illegal activities, such as drugs and torture. The NSA is regularly above the constitution.) Private spies are not yet connected like the mafia, but still can get caught operating out of the legal or constitutional boundaries.
Looking at the past 10 years of the software industry, I still can't wrap my head around the approach that most large companies have taken to hiring software engineers; treating them as literal cogs in the machine, designing processes which place trust in the hands of middle managers and bureaucrats instead of engineers. There was literally no vetting process for engineers. Now every corner of the internet is full of viruses, spyware and backdoors and of course middle managers had no idea. Nobody is responsible for the software so it belongs to intelligence agencies and hackers.
The software industry turned out so different from how I thought it would. When I decided to pursue it as a career, I thought that software engineers would be treated and given responsibilities like managers.
It's crazy when you think about it; managers are responsible for their people, whom they have limited control over... Yet software engineers have zero responsibility for the software they produce, which they have almost full control over.
I was a private yacht chef for 7 years. They would hire anyone off the street to work on a $35,000,000 private yacht without checking references or a background check. I had unprecedented access to CEO's of Fortune 100 companies and phone numbers of a couple billionaires on my phone. I thought about writing a spy novel where a bunch of college students got entry level jobs on a yacht and used the access to plant bugs. The plot is they get caught and have to escape the Caribbean while being chased.
You have my preorder. Post your keybase in your profile and let’s get the ball rolling.
1. A group of EECS graduates get jobs as deckhands and stewardesses on mega yachts in order to bug the yachts to glean information for trading securities.
2. They install computers in the electronics cave below the wheelhouses because nobody knows what most of the electronics there do in the first place.
Today there are hundreds of mega yachts in Fort Lauderdale, Florida with thousands of unscreened workers maintaining the yachts before they leave in November for a season of cruising and charters in the Caribbean.
3. They get caught by Russian mafia while in Martinique or St. Lucia.
4. They MacGyver their way out of the Caribbean while being chased by thugs with unlimited resources.
I'll get around to writing it one of these days.
[dead]
In almost every industry this is the case. Perhaps with the exception of some government contractors.
Even with projects that went to extreme cost to maintain secrecy ultimately failed to do so, IE the Manhattan project.
Most tech companies (and non-tech companies) take a fairly pragmatic approach. Generally trust your employees but configure systems with an audit trail so you can hold them accountable later for malicious actions. If accidental, there's not much you can do anyway so just buy insurance.
> Nobody is responsible for the software
Sounds like the accountability sink[0].
0. https://www.ft.com/content/2e1042d5-5e89-4fb6-bbee-de605a534...
This blog post is so scattered
A couple of years ago, a dipshit moron in the US Army leaked a bunch of top secret documents on Discord, mostly related to the Ukrainian war.
The thing is, these documents were kinda bad. The information in them was not any better than the work of open source intelligence, and analyses were as good (bad) as that of many armchair analysts.
So it's no wonder that spy agencies are getting left behind.
> information in them was not any better than the work of open source intelligence
Now look at the dates on those documents.
Big difference between knowing the Japanese fleet is off Pearl Harbor at 7AM versus 8:01.
They did not reveal anything new in particular.
To be clear, CIA and other agencies probably have HUMINT sources that are still ahead of the open source intelligence.
Their SIGINT is likely still ahead as well, although even that advantage is fading. During the Ukrainian conflict, we were able to track the activities of the armies by using NASA's publicly available infrared brush fire tracker satellites (FIRMS - https://firms.modaps.eosdis.nasa.gov/map/#d:24hrs;@38.1,48.0... ). And you can literally pay $100 and get a picture of any area on the planet, with a resolution that is good enough to track vehicles.
I don't understand why your comment is being retrieved so unpopularily thus far.
The decline in quality that you're describing not withstanding, I'm not surprised that private intelligence companies are on the rise as opposed to state agencies. I reckon that won't be for long though and that eventually any distinction between the two will be nominal.
> I'm not surprised that private intelligence companies are on the rise as opposed to state agencies
Me, neither. The private sector almost universally pays more for top talent, so much of the top talent will go there. It's also probably a better culture.
As more government agencies outsource intelligence (and consequently, decision-making) to the private sector, companies like Palantir and OpenAI will become even more the de-facto government than they already are.
> As more government agencies outsource intelligence (and consequently, decision-making) to the private sector, companies like Palantir and OpenAI will become even more the de-facto government than they already are.
This is basically what I was alluding to. The stage is set all too well for this not to occur.
I predict we’ll head to a Holy Roman Empire or Snow Crash style of federated fragmented powers that in aggregate we can call The United States but in reality it’s a bunch of jockeying nobles and oligarchs.
Maybe it always was, and the US Revolution was to allow this by tearing down unitary monarch power.
The problem with said situation is that being big is such a winning move post-industrialization, even before divide and conquer shenanigans to play at 'colonizing India'. Fractal balkanization isn't exactly a winning move and there is a reason why a unified Germany became a significant power above and beyond its most bellicose states.
This is a feature of capitalism, nothing to see here.
Any source for the "not any better than the work of open source intelligence" part?
I'm following the war pretty closely, and the documents basically added no real analysis compared to the open source intelligence community (Christo Grozev, Conflict Intelligence Team, Oryx). E.g. their analysis of Wagner group was inferior to the one published by investigative journalists.
I think it’s GP’s own evaluation
I’d prefer a neutral account. In conclusion, is it fair to say that the leak was a breach of US protocol or law and was publicly-available information?
Well don’t leave us hanging, what did the documents reveal?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2022%E2%80%932023_Pentagon_doc...
Oh, the thugshaker incident. Now I remember.
Their post is somehow even worse quality than the stuff they’re complaining about. To answer your question, a lot of the documents were vehicle/weapon data, thickness of armor plates of tanks and such. Specifically regarding what is best searched as “War Thunder Discord leaks”, as it was, supposedly, a bunch of War Thunder players trying to one-up each other on how knowledgeable they were on military hardware. Some of them (there were a good handful over the years) are detailed here: https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?l=polish...
War Thunder are to my knowledge the only game studio who have had to publicly tell their fans not to send them classified material in order to advocate for a balance change.
Russia: pls nerf F35, it's too OP.
Sounding like a broken record here. Your bank and state government will sell your data to these brokers. Just in case any of you think your TOR browser saves you.
Not what this article is about.
Sell and buy